It's true, I can't enumerate all of the details, but I have heard example after example over the years. My friends will communicate directly, whereas the husbands communicate by implying what they need, then mope, whine, or be passive-aggressive when they don't get it (often because they never asked for it--the implied it.)
One of my friends, said that she wonders if this is a natural stage that occurs in the evolution of gender equality because for so long, men didn't know what women were capable of since they had fewer options than men. She speculated that men are now seeing what women are capable of, and it makes them insecure.
These women, btw, are not ball-busting, radical feminists, (radical feminists are those who think women ARE better than men, which is asinine, IMO) just to proactively redress that obvious and thoughtless response. They are sensitive, responsive, and feminine. And, they are strong.
So, what's the deal, in your opinion? And, how do traditional gender roles impact your relationship with your spouse? Thoughts?Do you think men are the new women?
I believe that is the process that people go through when they find their ';equal'; would seem like a transition from dominant to ';weak';, but that's not it at all.
I think that when a man finds a woman he can honor and respect, he finds it more difficult to stand his ground, so it may come off as whiny when that isn't the case at all.
Very interesting observation though!Do you think men are the new women?
Actual physical evolution takes generations to see the effects of.
Sounds like these men have been culturally emasculated. If these women want their men to be chest beating neanderthols, they should send them to a mens empowerment group. I refuse to be responsible for the results of such action.
Your explanation is also far more simplistic than the reality can possibly be. As you are all friends, this may be a manifestation of your specific group culture.
Or they could just be a bunch of spineless weenies.
So...women were the whiny passive aggressive ones, now men are the whiny passive aggressive ones. Did I miss the change? Oh damn, I knew I missed something. Did you ask the husbands how they feel about their wives? Women are JUST as PA as men, they're just quicker to label it, thereby justifying their position in an argument.
The women don't put out and the men are sick of it. Fighting back directly doesn't work, because NOTHING works. The men have given up.
Did those women mention to you that they don't put out? Nope, I bet they left out that detail.
I think most men today equate being a pansy with being a ';modern man';. Nope, not at my house. The only thing that will work is having another man ridicule them for being a b***h.
i got bigger things to worry about... like how i'm gonna pay for the 1200$ medical bill i just got yesterday.
Ok
You've made some interesting points. I think that personal growth might take a man into the realm of emotional thinking and functioning, and that these are skills that have a certain transitional phase. Kind of like growing pains. Assertiveness, regardless of where they learn it can bring additional skills to help balance things out. It is a process, and some guys are running down blind alleys in this area. Eventually though, I think they become a better person and they find life has deeper meaning once they are able to meter the emotonal aspects.
Traditional roles will always have some merit, but for the most part, I prefer to think that society as we know it is changing, and as such, we are all finding ourselves with the opportunity to to grow and improve the quality of life that we have. I have also found that a large number of divorces happen because of a failure to grow as persons and as a couple, and often it seems that there is a obvious lack of equality between partners.
The insecurity that some men encounter in these situations is simply a lack of confidence when dealing with their own emotions and with time and experience their confidence will grow. I do think of it as transitory, and women (these wifes for example) can take the opportunity to help their male counterpart through these transitional periods. Learning proper assertivenes is always helpful
Yes, no doubt, relationships have changed. Since the sixties, since the pill, since the more liberal divorce laws, since Aid to Dependent Children, since job equality. These changes have produced uncertainty, because with a lack of mores and cultural bias, anything goes. On top of this we have opened up our world with ';Choice Pollution'; that has made it ever more difficult to come to the right decision.
Yes, we will have to retrace our cultural void. No society can survive without some restriction. Check out my source and the book I recommend to get a handle to the dilemma you are writing about.
I think it has to do with our culture. 20 years ago the stereo type was the dumb blonde. The wife stayed home, had kids and took care of the house. Now with more women in the work place, they are expressing themselves and demand accountability.
Look at tv. Who is portrayed as the dumb, useless know nothing. The men. Most TV programs show women in charge and being the smart ones, where men are dumb and uneducated. Look at the sitcoms. Same situation. Men are slow and stupid, and women have the brains and smart. Slow transition and reversal of roles to take men out of their natural role as head of the house and family. No longer do you have the husband and wife as a team raising a family but same sex households destroying the whole notion of a proper family.
I see this same thing going on. My ex husband was like that. I could not stand it, and I didn't know how to quite handle it. I felt like I was married to a spoiled ********* y chick. He never paid attention. He never kept track of his money or anything around the house. He was jumping from job to job. I was the one making all the money, doing every thing in the house, doing everything for our child. I eventually just stopped doing anything for him after I asked him to move out. Than he would not move out so I did.
I hated being in a relationship like that. Maybe that's why there are so many more lesbians and homosexuals now!!! LOL
I agree, I have noticed the same trend! I think men typically are more concerned with their own wants and needs than anything else, and when they don't get their own way, they get pouty and passive aggressive. In past generations, men who did not get their way felt free to hit their wives, get a mistress or just take off. Their options are limited now that women are stong enough and smart enough not to put up with their crap :) Just my opinion.
I believe that women are stronger than men and always have been. I have not known a man personally yet that wasn't whiny and passive-aggressive. Then they get together and talk about what 'they' have accomplished just to make themselves feel better.
Nothing against Christianity, but if you do a little research things were very different before they came along and made men 'in-charge'.
Children used to take their mothers last name, not the name of the father. Women were the head of the house, since men couldn't be counted on to be there (and maybe not even live long enough), most of the Gods were female not male, and women were held at a higher level than men because of their spirituality and abilities to heal, etc.
Things have not always been the way that they are now, and I believe that society held women down as long as they can. Now things are coming back to a place where women will be able to show their true abilities and power. We are pretty awesome if I do say so myself.
I love men and my husband and two sons are spoiled rotten... they also look to me to make sure everything is as it should be. Women have actually always held control (anyone that has been married knows this), but it was not ok to admit it.
Being with a strong woman shouldn't be emasculating to a man. The problem that I've seen is that men have a problem creating an identity consistent with the traditional role models of a masculine male that is compatible with the reality of the present day stronger, professional, intelligent woman. I find these woman intense and very attractive. At the same time women's biology hasn't changed just their mentality. I think you can still be a traditional gentleman but you have to be sure you convey your actions as respect and not as patronizing to the weaker sex. You can still be assertive as a man and have a sensitive side, in fact women find it very appealing. When you are going to let your masculine/aggressive side come out you have to be intelligent about how and why. In general, I'd say women want a more sensitive man as their friend but they still want that masculine man to be their lover and to make them feel like the feminine woman they are while being respected as equals in the friendship/partnership of a long term relationship.
